Prisoners get swine flu shots ahead of civilians in need : ATOM 0.3

Prisoners get swine flu shots ahead of civilians in need

"We locked 'em up. Now we own them." Who deserves flu shots more, inmates or the public?

What say ye?

donteatpoop @ 11/4/2009 8:39:47 PM

M1A1? I freaking love that song!

What? Oh... Sorry, my mistake.

meggysue @ 11/4/2009 8:26:24 PM

« lumberjack : It doesn't matter why you're in prison; just being in a confined space with that many other people puts you at risk. If the flu spreads through that confined population, there is nowhere you can go to escape it. So yes, of course they should all be vaccinated, or at least have it offered to them.

. If I'm not mistaken, the rights of an inmate don't often include the right to refuse, especially when it involves the 'greater good.'

lumberjack @ 11/4/2009 6:25:27 PM

It doesn't matter why you're in prison; just being in a confined space with that many other people puts you at risk. If the flu spreads through that confined population, there is nowhere you can go to escape it. So yes, of course they should all be vaccinated, or at least have it offered to them.

icepigs @ 11/4/2009 3:42:25 PM

« zebrahdh :
You or someone you love(or just know)could go to jail for the most useless reason imaginable at any time.

Breaking the law? That's usually the reason you go to prison.

And usually, you don't go to a prison for "useless" reasons. Either you've been convicted of a felony, or you've had multiple convictions.

If it's just a few unpaid parking tickets, you may go to jail...but no prison.

Qpon @ 11/4/2009 1:44:43 PM

I wasn't being cereal, vaccinate your anger

chinook @ 11/4/2009 11:20:01 AM

« Qpon:Visitors wouldn't be bringing it in if they could get their vaccines!

Actually, yes they still could. Vaccines don't grant people immunity, they just significantly reduce the chances of getting a disease.

That's why vaccination campaigns must be large-scale and widespread in order for them to work: it's herd immunity, not just each individual vaccine, that keeps us safe.

lynxears @ 11/4/2009 11:01:08 AM

« stinkobinko : I'm curious as to why you so often interject with such condescension.

Because s/he's had it explained twice now and is either ignoring the explanation or sees it and refuses to acknowledge it. Both are just wasting time when the answer has been given.

stinkobinko @ 11/4/2009 10:55:50 AM

« lynxears :
So short-sighted, geez.

I'm curious as to why you so often interject with such condescension.

lynxears @ 11/4/2009 10:46:24 AM

« Qpon : Visitors wouldn't be bringing it in if they could get their vaccines!

Unless the visitor CHOSE not to get the vaccine.

And yes, they still could. They could be vaccinated and have shaken hands with a person right outside the prison who had it and, ta-da, they're a carrier.

So short-sighted, geez.

meggysue @ 11/4/2009 10:10:50 AM

Zebradh makes an excellent point in saying to be mad about the vaccine shortage, not its recipients. Inmates who receive visitors, at least in minimum security, are allowed to hold their small children, briefly kiss their loved ones, hold hands where they can be seen, etc. In my state, conjugal visits are a thing of the past. Prisons are fishbowls, and as much as I wish the vaccine was readily available to anyone who might want it, I have to agree that this is a prudent move. Do I resent that the 9-11 mastermind is getting his shot before I can get mine? Maybe a little, but I don't envy imprisonment without benefit of trial for years.

On the other side of the coin, some petty criminals play the system by committing crimes just illegal enough to land them in prison where prior experience has adapted them to the system, all their needs are met, and they have people doting on them from the outside (visiting, sending money and what gifts are allowed). There are a lot of them in minimum security. It's easier for them to milk the taxpayers for three hots and a cot than taking the 'hard road' of eaking out a living on the outside. Finding employment with a criminal history is no easy task, but we shouldn't make it so easy on those kinds of criminals. It's a balancing act determining how to do that.

Qpon @ 11/4/2009 10:08:46 AM

« KEROberos32 : AHEM!!!

Visitors wouldn't be bringing it in if they could get their vaccines!

chinook @ 11/4/2009 10:02:08 AM

What zebra said.

I absolutely despise the tone of the second article linked. If there's one thing that's driving me nuts about this whole H1N1 deal it's that every journalist (i.e. all the ones that have no specialisation on medicine) or every person with an opinion feels entitled to blast public heath procedures when most have absolutely no idea or knowledge of standard health procedures in the first place.

Because I'm confident that if either of the author of the second article were really informed, they wouldn't see it as giving terrorists (you can sure tell it's an American article!) vaccines instead of pregnant women, but would instead see it as attempting to ensure the virus stays out of a place that has the potential to devastate the local population as well as providing ample opportunity for mutation which would pose an even greater threat to the general population which includes pregnant women etc.

Giving prisons priority is just like giving northern isolated communities priority. All it takes is one person, and the entire community, the community with immune systems that aren't often exposed to new bugs, and everyone's out.

KEROberos32 @ 11/4/2009 9:59:12 AM

« Qpon : Why would they need shots? None of them should be getting out to get infected!!

AHEM!!!

« lynxears : All it takes is one outside visitor/employee to bring it in on their hands or clothes, and you've got a close-quarters environment trap...

Qpon @ 11/4/2009 9:34:57 AM

Why would they need shots? None of them should be getting out to get infected!!

badbud @ 11/4/2009 8:20:53 AM

This is a CYA measure. Imagine the cost (AND law suits!) when an entire prison population is struck with H1N1.

And a prisoner dies...

drogue @ 11/4/2009 5:13:45 AM

Honestly, the screeds I've read about this vaccine range from "What are they putting into us?" to "Everybody must get this now, before it runs out!"

My plan, since I live in a temperate area, am relatively-young, and don't have a lot of contact with people, and their nasal effluvia, is neither to get the shot, nor go anywhere near where they give it.

Like I've done for nearly my entire f*cking life.

Should a prisoner be able to make the same choice? Yes.

bingo @ 11/4/2009 2:02:02 AM

« zebrahdh :

I'm not saying other people don't deserve the vaccine, I'm just saying that controlling an epidemic in the forced close-quarter circumstances of a prison is far more socially responsible.

I agree, this makes a lot of sense.

And why shouldn't they get it? Really, can anyone tell me?

KerOBeroS32 @ 11/3/2009 11:11:32 PM

meh

lynxears @ 11/3/2009 10:01:30 PM

« stinkobinko : Being that prisoners live in a closed environment, wouldn't they be among those LEAST likely to even get teh flu?

All it takes is one outside visitor/employee to bring it in on their hands or clothes, and you've got a close-quarters environment trap.

Sure, if it was Alcatraz, maybe. But even there the families and prison had to get supplies from outside. There is no completely closed prison.

stinkobinko @ 11/3/2009 9:45:18 PM

Being that prisoners live in a closed environment, wouldn't they be among those LEAST likely to even get teh flu? Also, they're not deciding who gets the shot by who deserves it most but by who is most likely to suffer teh worst complications.

zebrahdh @ 11/3/2009 9:41:45 PM

I love the highbrow attitude towards prisoners.

The prisons are overcrowded first of all, mostly because people that get arrested can't pay for the lawyers that can keep them out of jail. And generally all lawyers do are find technicalities to either put someone in jail, or keep them out.

You or someone you love(or just know)could go to jail for the most useless reason imaginable at any time. So now they are trapped in a box (for reasons you may or may not agree with) with people either just like them, or are the absolute scum of the Earth. So you want them to get sick and possibly DIE just because some people that have personal access to stores, pharmacies, doctors, hospitals, clinics, anti-bacterial soap, and clean homes 24/7 don't want to have to risk it?

Im not saying other people don't deserve the vaccine, I'm just saying that controlling an epidemic in the forced close-quarter circumstances of a prison is far more socially responsible.

Get mad that there aren't enough vaccines, not at where they are being used.

Bornbad @ 11/3/2009 9:18:06 PM

My son's teacher is out with H1N1. I hope people are aware of the issue.